Best Song Ever: Buck 65's "Zombie Delight"

CHARTattack think "Zombie Delight" is the Best Song Ever! So we spent almost 40 minutes talking to Buck 65 about his ode to the brain-eating undead.

CHARTattack: Where did the idea to write a song about zombies come from?
Buck 65: Well, I recorded that song and a bunch of material that's made up the bulk of the stuff that's been on these [20 Odd Years] EPs that I've been releasing for the last couple of months in Halifax last summer, and I don't remember exactly where along the process this happened, but a week or two into recording, Michael Jackson died. I guess, like everybody else, I found myself strangely affected by that. I remember just being in a really strange mood, and I just found myself thinking about Michael Jackson and his career a lot.

So, there was a song on the first EP [20 Odd Years, Vol. 1 - Avant] called "Superstars Don't Love," which talks about Michael Jackson a lot. So that was the first song, I guess, in this process that I've released that sort of alluded to, you know, Michael Jackson and him being in my thoughts at that time.

But then I just started thinking about the video for "Thriller," and I remember being really — I mean, I was a kid, I guess, at the time it came out — but I was really super into it, borderline obsessed, I guess. I remember watching some documentary thing with my sister all about the making of "Thriller" and I was just really super-fascinated with the whole thing, and so I guess in my song, the real giveaway is the line where I say, "One weird thing is that they're excellent dancers."

In fact, I think I'm hoping that it will bring that to mind for people, even if I don't say so directly. Where else are they going to have the image of dancing zombies, really, other than the "Thriller" video?

So, yeah, I think it probably came from there in a big way, and at the same time, I had already had the instrumental for the song, the piece of music. It was done first, and I was trying to figure out what the heck to do with it. I couldn't quite figure that out, and when I guess thoughts of zombies and Michael Jackson and "Thriller" popped into my head, and then I listened to that piece of music again, I thought, 'Oh, you know what? I think this could maybe work with this in a crazy sort of way,' and so I was off and running.



Do you watch a lot of zombie movies?
I have definitely seen my fair share. I was quite the junkie when I was younger, and my wife is pretty into them, and my wife and I we really went into a phase where we watched a whole bunch of them. We kind of got caught up with what's going on with zombie movies these days. So I know a few people that are better experts and more into it than I am. My agent in the U.K. is a really serious zombie movie junkie, which reminds me; I don't know if he's heard this song yet. I should send it to him right away. I'm sure he'll be excited, but... But yeah, I've seen a bunch.

So what's your favourite?
Well, you know, the funny thing is that sometimes it can be hard to distinguish one from the other, especially if it's a [George] Romero thing because the titles are all so similar to one another. But I remember when I was a kid, I was really into — oh, gosh, I'm never going to get the titles straight — it's the one... and it turns out it's only one, even though it became sort of a zombie cliche, but there's this one I remember with these — well, I remember there were a couple zombies in the movie that were almost punk rock zombies, and it was the one where the zombies say, "Brains!" It's something ...Of The Living Dead, I think, but what? Oh, God, I can't quite remember.

But whatever that one is, I can't quite figure out, but that's the one where they actually say, "brains." I think people assume zombies say, "brains" in all zombie movies, but I found myself thinking about it a couple of years ago and concluded that it's only in this one movie, actually, where you hear that.

I'm actually not positive that it's a Romero film. I think it might have been someone that's, you know, jumping on the bandwagon and made a zombie movie that was very much a Romero rip-off.

You know, I know a lot of people who got pretty excited a couple years ago about, [asks his wife in the background] what were they called, the zombie movies where they run fast? 28 Days Later, yeah. I know a lot of people are really into that, and I know a lot of people who've commented including my wife that the high speed zombies, there's something extra-scary about that. I guess I can sort of see the appeal, but I guess I'm just sort of old school with all my childhood zombie movie experience. I guess I expect them to be slow, and just have that classic look, that classic zombie. I can't believe I'm having this conversation!

The whole arms out, walking really slowly, kind of not bending their knees and going, "Uggggggghhhhhhhh!"
[Laughing] Totally, that's my style of zombie, right there.

And when I went through that phase with my wife a couple of years ago, I got into really some more obscure, more underground, low budget zombie movies.

I remember there being another one that predated that one that Romero made a couple years ago, I think that he shot in Toronto. I think he used a bunch of Canadian actors that was sort of documentary style. [He's referring to Romero's Survival Of The Dead, which was shot in Toronto and Port Dover, Ont. with a Canadian cast and crew.]

And there was another one like that from a few years before, and I think it might have been British. I wish I could remember the titles better, but I remember thinking that one was pretty good.

But like I said, although I've seen a whole bunch, I wouldn't necessarily call myself an expert. Maybe that's kinda obvious now.

The punk rock one — is that The Return Of The Living Dead?
You know that, I think it is. I think that's exactly right. I can picture the cover, or at least the cover I remember seeing when I was a kid, and on the artwork for the cover you see like a zombie with a mohawk or something like that.

Yeah! That's it. We solved it. We solved the mystery.
Although I can't stop myself — wait, what did you say it was? The Return Of The Living Dead?

Yeah. I think it's Dan O'Bannon who did it.
Yeah, I'm searching for it right now. I feel like I need to. That's the one! That's totally the one! With the mohawk zombie on the front and like I said, I'm almost positive that's the one where they say, "brains." I can picture an exact image of this particular zombie saying it. I remember watching it at my friend's birthday party when I was a kid.

What would be, for you, the best way to dispense with a zombie? If one was running at you 28 Days Later-style, or if one was walking towards you with its arms out, what would be the best way to get rid of one? What would you do?
Well, there's a part of me that, even when I'm performing the song I almost flinch a little because I feel like it's the most violent thing I've ever said, but there's a line in the song where I say, "Shoot 'em in the head! It's the zombie apocalypse."

You know, the wisdom seems to be in this one and seems to go across several zombie movies that that's the only way. A very strong blow to the head with a gunshot being the most effective. There's that. I don't have a gun. I guess I imagine if and when the zombie apocalypse comes, I would try and find one as fast as I could.

But then there's the line where I say, "Hey, batter, hit 'em in the head and they may splatter." The idea is you could maybe use a baseball bat as well, and having a bit of a baseball background myself and having a couple of bats here in the house, I guess I've had strange fantasies of that being my personal course of action.

Have you seen Shaun Of The Dead?
Yes. That was a good one. I waited a while to see it. I don't know why because it had a lot of hype around it at the time.

I think I maybe know what you're thinking. The scene where one of the guys gets the zombie with the record?

Yeah, and there's something in there with a cricket bat, too. But the records is a pretty great scene.
That's pretty good and works for me as a DJ. That's kind of a nice fantasy. Well, I can't believe I'm saying that, but yeah, I mean, you know, it kind of works for me that a couple methods that I've seen in films before fit in nicely with my lifestyle: the baseball thing or the DJ approach.

So, you know, I feel like I'm fairly well equipped for those methods with what I've got here in my house with there being about 40,000 records here in my house. That's a lot of ammunition against a whole lot of zombies.

You know, I remember seeing that scene and having this weird thought process one day, just imagining zombies entering my house and then, you know, using records like that to try and get them, but then thinking, "Oh, my God! I can't use this record!" But that sort of happened in the movie, too. Didn't the guy just sort of hesitate, like, "No, I can't possibly part with this record"? I'd probably have the same dilemma, like, pulling out a record I paid $250 for and thinking, "Oh, God, I can't, you know, I can't get blood all over it or risk breaking it..." It'd be a bit of a dilemma. I'm sure there'd just be a moment or flinch where I would think twice for just a second and then I would probably realize, "Oh, yeah. I might get killed, so..."

You know, that was actually going to be my next question. I was going to ask you how you'd react if you picked up a record and flinched thinking you didn't want to throw it, just like the character in Shaun Of The Dead.
Do you remember what record that was that he pulled out and was like, "Oh, no, I can't throw this one?"

Purple Rain. Sign 'O' The Times.
Oh, yeah. Well those aren't rare. You would be able to replace them really easily.

They throw a Batman soundtrack, and they throw a Dire Straits record. There's a Stone Roses record, and Sade. That's his girlfriend's, and then the other character says, "Yeah, but she dumped you," so they end up throwing that one.
Right, right. That's pretty awesome. That's a great scene. In my back room of my house, I have records that are sort of on the floor that I think I've just sort of relegated to — you know, without it ever gaining official status as a crap pile. So if they were entering from the rear of my house, I'd probably be in luck there, 'cause it's a bunch of records I don't really care about. There's a huge pile of records that I just sort of found once and they're just records that I don't really care about.

Then, most of my most valuable ones aren't really easy to access; like I've got them locked away in boxes, so they're probably the ones I would get to last anyway. And then most of the ones that I have on my shelves in my house here kind of fall somewhere in the middle. So some of them would be hard, like Joy Division records and stuff like that would be difficult. There's this Lee Hazlewood record on my shelf in my living room, and that's the one I paid $250 for. It's really rare. I have a feeling that if I pulled it out I'd be like, "No, take whatever's next to it just in case I survive this thing. I'm not going to want to lose that Lee Hazlewood."

If you could be a zombie, what type of zombie would you want to be? Would you want to be a fast zombie or a slow one?
Well, you know, I hate to go back on what I was saying earlier, but it seems like in those old movies, those slow ones often get mowed down in big numbers all at once. With the faster ones that you see in the later movies, it seems like people are lucky if they can get one. It seems like your chances are lasting a bit longer are probably better if you're fast, I suppose, but strangely I feel that pull back again towards the classic old school style.

It sort of happened naturally, but as I've been performing the song lately there has been a bit of a zombie dance that has sort of developed. So me dancing as a zombie and I suppose playing a bit of a role of a zombie myself, it has taken on that classic posture. So I guess I've already indulged that fantasy a bit, and it was kind of old school and more slow moving, I guess. So based on actually experience, I would say old and slow.

Well, that ties in with the "Thriller" thing, too, right?
Well, exactly. They were all pretty slow moving. Though some of the parts of that dance routine they seem like they're moving pretty well. But at the beginning of that video as well, where they're coming out of the ground, they all seem like they're pretty slow moving, classic zombie style.

Are there any living people around that you think are kind of zombie-esque or who are kind of like zombies?
Well, kind of on the flip side of the coin of that, last week was the — I forget if it was the birth date or the anniversary of the death of Bela Lugosi [it was the anniversary of his death] — and I remember stopping and thinking about that and it was like, you know, he always played kind of undead in movies 'cause he's famous for playing Dracula. Then, of course, he died infamously during the middle of the filming of Plan 9 From Outer Space, the Ed Wood film.

So I remember thinking, "You know, there's no way Bela Lugosi actually died because he never really seemed like he was alive in the first place." So it's hard for me to imagine that he died. That doesn't even really make sense to me, so there's a part of me that believes Bela Lugosi is still out there and walking around with his arms out in front of him, zombie-like, like those images I have of him from Ed Wood movies and stuff. So if we can consider Bela Lugosi still a living person, then I would offer his name up. But let me think...

Sometimes I feel a bit that way myself, if I can add myself, with all these old injuries. I'm in physiotherapy right now for about three or four ailments, and on different days if I wake up and they're all bothering me at once I feel a bit dead but still walking around, so there's that.

Beyond that, let me think. I guess the first idea that pops into my head is, you know, who's someone that almost seems dead or who's maybe, like, old and decrepit but still going somehow? I'm trying to think about it. It's funny how you hear those questions pop up sometimes or those ideas where people assume that someone who used to be in the public eye is still alive, and its really embarrassing, you know?

Like with Abe Vigoda how everyone thought he was dead, and everyone always thinks he's dead, but he's not.
Exactly! And admittedly, even when you first asked that question a picture of his face kind of flashed in my mind a little bit, but then I didn't want to say it! There's a reference that'll get the kids excited.

So is there anything else you wanted to add before we wrap this up?
The song had its real genesis in a kind of interesting way. I was walking down the street one day and I ran into Afie Jurvanen from Bahamas, and we just started chatting, and he was telling me about how he just had a whole bunch of guitar parts that he had come up with this certain project or whatever that didn't end up working out, and so he said, "You know, if you ever need any hot licks," or whatever — which I don't know if he said it exactly like that, but he may have, like in the way Afie talks, you know.

So I said, "Yeah, I'd love it," because this was going back to before I started working on all this material and I was gathering ideas.

So he came over to my house one day a few days after that with his guitar and then just a little pig-nosed amp, a little tiny thing, and we just went into the back room of my house and I just plugged in a shitty little 68 mic, and he just started playing these really weird, almost like, funk licks. We just recorded them in the most, like, lo-fi way imaginable. It was one of those licks.

We never did re-record it; it's just like that really basic thing from the back of my house that became the foundation of "Zombie Delight." So that main lick that the song starts with started with him, and the song probably never would have been what it is now without him planting the seeds of it. Of course, you know, I want to be giving Afie credit for the song sounding like it does 'cause it's pretty awesome, I think.

The other big musical aspect of the song that I'm really proud of is that the drums in the song — and maybe this is too technical for anyone to really care about — but it's not a live drummer. It's just the most insane, extensive drum chopping and programming that I've ever done, including the solo, and I think it's the only song that I've ever done that has a drum solo in it, like this little breakdown part with this crazy drum solo part.

That just came from chopping up — I mean micro chopping up — drum parts for like, two days, and coming up with that whole thing, which I was really super-excited about with just how it sounded in the end.

I guess the other thing, as well, is that I was thinking about a chorus for the song, and I already had this lick from Afie [sings it], and then just as a working thing, I remember one day when I was demoing the song and I knew at that point when it was going to be about zombies, I just wanted to like, as a placeholder, just basically plug in words at random just to mark where the chorus would be.

So, not really thinking and just being a total goofball in the studio and just making things up off the top of my head, even though it makes no sense at all, I just said, "Zombie delight, zombie delight, zombies are coming to get you tonight." Like, "zombie delight," it doesn't make any sense at all, but it was so absurd and it made me laugh enough at the time that I thought, "What the hell, I'm just going to keep it like that."

That was never the intention. I thought I'd write a better chorus later. I just completely made it up off the top of my head as the tape was rolling, basically, and then just decided to keep it in the end because it was absurd enough, and then we decided to put vocoder on it — for again, whatever esoteric reason, not that it makes any kind of sense. But there were a lot of laughs had, suffice to say, as that song was coming together in the studio.